UPDATE: We're picking members now:
https://portableapps.com/node/15776
Now that I'm back into the daily grind, I'd like to get some comments on a plan I've come up with to help get the app releases moving.
I'm calling it the "Release Team". It will consist of 5 (for now) volunteers who will help drive an app from dev test to pre-release to final. There will be a dedicated members-only mailing list for these devs to discuss releases and when they approve them. A release can move from the dev test to pre-release stage or the pre-release to final stage when at least 3 of the 5 sign off on the app (note: this is assuming the other two aren't available for a week or so... if one says no, then it doesn't move forward until the issue is addressed). Since they'll be able to directly talk via the mailing list and get notification of each other's messages, they should be able to keep things moving faster than in the forums. There will also be a wiki page where public notes and approvals can be kept by the team so those outside can monitor the status of apps.
The splash screens will be available to the team as well as to the volunteer designers. I'm compiling templates for GIMP, Photoshop and Paint Shop Pro (if desired) so that they'll be easy to manage and create splashes for new apps without me being a roadblock in this dev test to pre-release step.
The releases will be handled in the PortableApps.com Development (portableappsdev) SourceForge.net project with multiple release techs provided Kevin Porter is still cool with helping manage that. This will allow us to have more release techs without having multiple techs with access to our critical production apps (like Firefox and Thunderbird) so we don't expose ourselves to too much risk (if someone's SF password was guessed, they couldn't replace Firefox Portable 3.0.1 with something else, for instance). We still need a method for getting releases from devs to release techs as SF doesn't allow one person to upload and another to release. Any thoughts?
I'm also thinking about the Source hosting. We need to ensure we are hosting the source for each of the packaged apps for each version we release. We could have the release techs do it (and possibly have more than 5) or we could have a team dedicated to ensuring the source is available. This would usually just require the ability to use FTP, etc but occasionally would require SVN ability as some apps only host their source in SVN.
The final roadblock is around the actual release. I'm considering switching from signing launchers and installers for releases to just signing the installers for apps besides our big ones. This would still give the end user the assurance that it's a real release from us (and a less scary install experience on XP and Vista with the exclamation mark as opposed to the red X stop warning) but would remove my having to recompile launchers for releases which would save a ton of time. But I'd love to hear some thoughts on this.
Ideally, I'd like to have the above in place this week or next at the latest so we can start pushing our new apps every day. So please chime in as soon as you can.
Thanks,
John
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Koodos on getting more people involved to take some stress off.
1.) I like the idea of a Release team. I've actually been hoping for one.
2.) I like the idea of a different signature for app signing. Have one for the pre-release and one for regular. I suggest not giving anyone the sigs for the standard release this is the internet and that can be taken advantage of.
3.) I would keep you as the only person that does the final releaseing. Sit back and let the release team go through the process of final checking then you do the actual release once they all give their approval.
4.) I'd like to sign up if I can help :).
Release Team Member
The development tests and pre-releases will continue to be unsigned for now just to keep me out of the chain (I don't want to hold things up). I'll be signing the installers for the actual final releases, though.
I'm gonna ask the community at large for suggestions on the team. And for help putting together a "what to check" list to ensure that things are working properly.
Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!
Ok, read this several times on the train.
Basically like it.
I agree with Jacob, you should have the say so on the final release.
One thing concerns me:
when 3 of the 5 sign off on the app
Maybe on dev test to pre-release,
But final release ?????
If 40% of the team is having reservations about moving to the next step I would be concerned
Given the following assumptions:
The five are intelligent, know what they are doing, and are open minded and unbiased.
I would think that the 3 should be able to show the 2 why they should move ahead. If not I think the concerns of the 2 should be brought to your attention.
Edited down
Edit: John has clarified the concern
Other than that all looks good to me
From my non-dev point of view
Tim
Things have got to get better, they can't get worse, or can they?
I would say if it was 4/1 then just go ahead but if it's 2/3 it would be worth John's time to stop and check it over himself as the final say so. But I think this team should be mainly the final stage in testing. When these people are ready they pick it appart piece by piece and then give it their stamp of approval.
Release Team Member
It's not about reservations, it's about availability. I'm assuming the other 2 aren't reachable for a week, for instance. If ANY of the 5 have a reason why it shouldn't progress, it shouldn't progress. But we can't assume all 5 will be available for all of the 100 upcoming releases.
Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!
Understood, that makes sense.
If ANY of the 5 have a reason why it shouldn't progress, it shouldn't progress.
I agree.
Tim
Things have got to get better, they can't get worse, or can they?
Although, I do wish I could do many things in life, this is one of them. But seeing that I don't know everything to check for, it would not be a very good idea.
This is a good idea John to get development test's and pre-releases out faster and out the door quicker, so we don't have to sit their annoying you on the IRC channel. ( Sorry John.
)
I hope the team is picked well.
Na na na, come on!
John, I think this is a fantastic idea. I agree wholeheartedly with everything you've said.
In regards to Tim and Jacob's reservations about the Release Team, I disagree with them. Obviously, I don't know how busy you are (I assume quite busy, as I can get pretty busy myself), but my understanding would be that, obviously, you would go through each of the apps before they were released. But, as I assume you would choose your Release Team based on trust, they wouldn't choose an app to be released that isn't worthy of release. Thus, there wouldn't be too much of a problem with apps that shouldn't be released.
About the PortableApps.com Development project, I'll add any release techs that need to be added. I am in agreement that it might be a good idea to keep the release techs on the main Sourceforge project to a minimum for security reasons.
Whatever you need me for, sign me up.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." - Rick Cook
i'll be backing the team and this project 100% x infinity, so lets hope this gets organised enough to happen.
But there’s no sense crying over every mistake,
You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.
@John I was going to agree with Jacob's comment about you be the one who does the final release, but then I thought about it and with what Kevin said about how busy you are, I would definitely have to agree. I would love to help on this team, as once school starts up again I'm bound to have a Windows installation and a lot more time (sounds weird, but I've just been working a lot during the summer). I'm typically always here during my school year and I've always got some time to help out here.
I ditto Kevin's last statement, I'm here for whatever you need me for.
if there's a way i can help out please let me know.
Lead, Follow, or get out of the way.
this will get those apps in PR cranked out
just out of curiosity how are we going to deal with the freeware launchers.
I hav a suggested method where the launcher will download the app. So the launcher is opensource and can be hosted of SF.net, but that is just an idea. I kno some stuff happened on this topic but i hav not heard anything recently.
Edit: And I am also willing to be part of the testing team.
I also like the IRC idea mentioned below
Please search before posting. ~Thanks
app releases moving
There will be a dedicated members-only mailing list for these devs to discuss releases and when they approve them.
Sounds a good idea. I don't know of the practicality of it (especially with potential time zone differences), but you could set up an IRC channel with only certain (registered) nicks permitted in... that isn't hard to set up, and it would mean you could have active duscussion.
if one says no, then it doesn't move forward until the issue is addressed
I think that that is very sensible. Quality control is only any use if it causes change in the design - which this should do :-).
There will also be a wiki page where public notes and approvals can be kept by the team so those outside can monitor the status of apps.
That's also a good idea.
The splash screens will be available to the team as well as to the volunteer designers. I'm compiling templates for GIMP, Photoshop and Paint Shop Pro (if desired) so that they'll be easy to manage and create splashes for new apps without me being a roadblock in this dev test to pre-release step.
GIMP, that's all I want
A clarification request: (to get your attention :P) What do you mean by "volunteer designers"? "The team" means the planned releases team, I presume, but do you mean other developers for "volunteer designers", or something else?
I've got to go now, so I'll give more answers later. It sounds good, though. Thanks!
I am a Christian and a developer and moderator here.
“A soft answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger.” – Proverbs 15:1
... cause it is an practicable way to take some pressure from You and put it on some other shoulders too
For me a release team is a good solution to have more than two or four eyes on the releases.
This will be a better way to prevent possible issues.
Paid for Software more or less?
What You need is OSS!
As a note with Subversion, releases are usually "tagged" (i.e. the code is copied as-is at time of release into a new directory) and we can just zip these up and put them on the file releases.
From now, I should have more time on my hands, so I'll tentatively volunteer. However, I'm frequently distracted by real life, so I may only be half there.
"If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate."
I like the idea very much.
I had the same questions Jacob had about the minority/majority thing but if its for availability reasons only, I think its ok. If each member has a minority to block the release, its ok. A separate IRC channel isn't necessary I think.
But Id like you to have the last word on an official release.
So I'm in if you want me.
"What about Love?" - "Overrated. Biochemically no different than eating large quantities of chocolate." - Al Pacino in The Devils Advocate
This is a GREAT idea!! I'd love to help, but of course, I have no idea what to look for. I would be more than happy and willing to provide hosting/ftp space for the apps until final release (and even then if needed). I don't have an SF account, but I have PLENTY of extra space and bandwidth that I can spare.
If you need it, the offer is there
one week and all this happened. I'm never vacationing again :P.
I like the idea. I'm also wondering if there could be a merger between portableappsdev and PGWinSuite (of course with several people's agreement).
As for the hand-off problem, there could be yet another invitational mailing list for the devs and release techs. Or if somebody was willing, there could be a release handoff ftp server where the techs had access to all files and devs would have access to their own folders.
As for the source, I think that the dedicated team would be best because then the release techs would have less load.
Great idea!
Insert original signature here with Greasemonkey Script.
I must have been on vacation too, I like the idea.
Too many lonely hearts in the real world
Too many bridges you can burn
Too many tables you can't turn
Don't wanna live my life in the real world
I'm willing to be part of the team
I got time
your friendly neighbourhood moderator Zach Thibeau