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portablepro
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[Closed] Major Bug?

I am doing this now several years.

When to "install" this to drive "D"
it ends to...D:\PortableApps\PortableApps
and there it goes for all.

but if i end up to install a lonely app it goes to
D:\PortableApps

This is a bug, error or whatever you might call it.
It disturbs the whole Structure of the Project.
Please fix it.

Might be the fault in your Description of "how to..."
but it is definately wrong.

causing many problems.

Thanks!

John T. Haller
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Platform?

By "this" I'm guessing maybe you mean the PA.c Platform? If so, it's designed to be installed to the root of the drive. So D:\. As it installs, it creates the PortableApps and Documents directories. If, when installing the platform, you manually select the D:\PortableApps directory, it will install those directories within the existing PortableApps directory.

The PA.c Installer used by the apps is much more simple. It just scans drives for a PortableApps directory in the root, essentially making things a little easier for most users. If you manually installed your platform to a non-standard directory, you'll need to manually select the D:\PortableApps\PortableApps directory yourself if you run the installer directly. Or you can use the App Store (which will put everything in the right place) and for apps not in the App Store, click Apps and then Install a New App (paf.exe) within the platform and then select the app installer you want to run. It will automatically feed it the correct path.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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Huh,

I thought you would make it easy to a "normal" user to use it?

It is not a normal problem for me, but it messes up an Installation for many not so IT-Tech Nerds than me.
I know, you will have to rewrite all install scripts to new...

Hard work, or you have scripts to do that, but it is definately an Error in this Platform to have two different paths!

please don't misunderstand me, I appreciate your work, but this is a major flaw!

THX

portablepro
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The fault:

It just scans drives for a PortableApps directory in the root, essentially making things a little easier for most users.

Yup, it does and then makes the fault to not directly accessing the right directory. - it does the wrong directory one stairs above.

Do you understand me right now? - It is just a directory structure Problem.

HTH

portablepro
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okay, step by step...

Ok. download and install to root D:

Apps will go to D:\PortableApps\PortableApps

when I download a app and install it - it will go to D:\PortableApps
so , it messes up the directory structure...

Edit:
even after restart and registered

anyone? am I the only one? - no, tried this on many...

THX

portablepro
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it creates the PortableApps and Documents directories.

This is correct.
And I like this, cause I can copy all essentials to where I want.
But again: Your Scripts are fault by design, by not going into the correct directory.

HTH

portablepro
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Example:

7Zip portable .paf download
setup
now i have 2 - (Two Folders) 7Zip folders. One in: D:\PortableApps\PortableApps\7-ZipPortable
and one in: D:\PortableApps\7-ZipPortable

Which one is used? I know, but not so tech-assumed might not be.

Edit: one was registered, the other one not.
I know that registering portable soft might be problematic, but in this case it works flawlesly.

THx
Why is that? Why?

Please keep this handy job doing.
THX

John T. Haller
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More Info

After closing the platform and all apps, please temporarily rename your D:\PortableApps directory to D:\PortableApps2 or similar. Download the PA.c Platform fresh, run it, select Custom Location, then select D:\. It should place Start.exe in your D:\ root and create a Documents and PortableApps directory. The PortableApps directory should contain a PortableApps.com directory containing the platform, etc. When you use the Platform's App Store, it should install apps in paths like D:\PortableApps\AppNamePortable. If you then download and run an app installer directly, it should automatically detect that location. You can then move any existing apps within D:\PortableApps2 and D:\PortableApps2\PortableApps to D:\PortableApps and everything should work as expected from there forward.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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huh, how to friendly post?

It is what i like about to portabalize soft to go where it has to go.
please dont get me wrong.

"it should automatically detect the direction" is what is going wrong...

HTH

John T. Haller
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Not Really

If you install to a non-standard place, how would a standalone installer know where to install to? The installers are working as designed. If you manually install to a custom location, it's assumed you'll know where you installed to and to manually install to the correct location that you selected. If you use the standard locations, it's handled for you. The other option would be to go back to what it was over a decade ago and have it blank by default requiring everyone to manually select a location.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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Lookup

registered paths in the registry
temporary
deleted and - closed

You seem not to understand my problem, which is a problem to make it smart.

John T. Haller
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Platform Running

In which case, the platform would be running. So why not install it via the Apps - Install (paf.exe) option within the platform?

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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In the case the platform is not running

I download a program from your platform as a .paf and save it to my drive.

I double click it and it will go to the wrong directory.

Anything wrong?

HTH

John T. Haller
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Search Paths

We're talking about a .paf.exe for an app... not the platform here. The PA.c Installer will look for ?:\PortableApps on each of your drives. The last drive found where that exists will be pre-filled in the path with \AppNamePortable after it. If it can't find that, it will prefill the location of the installer with \AppNamePortable after it. This is the way it's supposed to work.

If you install your PA.c Platform to X:\PortableApps\PortableApps, the installer will not automatically detect it. It will detect X:\PortableApps and offer to install to X:\PortableApps\AppNamePortable. It's up to you to manually select X:\PortableApps\PortableApps and then have it add \AppNamePortable.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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You name it

It's up to you to manually select X:\PortableApps\PortableApps and then have it add \AppNamePortable.

Why not to automate this?

portablepro
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OK, close

Thanks for your answers, really.
I now understand why you did it the way you did it.

THX

John T. Haller
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Why?

Why automate your specific use case? Why is that more valid than folks who have it set up as X:\PAc\PortableApps? Not to mention the fact that over 1/2 of our apps haven't been updated in over a year (since there's no new version) so your requested change won't even come to the majority of apps for years.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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Answer:

Might be a specific use case, but I do this somedays...

......
Why is that more valid than folks who have it set up as X:\PAc\PortableApps?

Because you do it in your app...

Not to mention the fact that over 1/2 of our apps haven't been updated in over a year (since there's no new version)

Hmmmmm....

Double Driver?
Have been using via SyMenu - flawlessly old school driver help tool - would be great to have that in papps...
Don't Sleep?

HTH

portablepro
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Sorry, that was to offensive.

reading this again, I apologize for this.

sorry

portablepro
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Oh my God

You seem not to understand my advice to the fault that you are doing in your installer.
You are doing the wrong path.
It is just some correction in the script to do some other lines and everything works perfect.

HTH

portablepro
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Example

Edit: delete.

portablepro
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So this now state of the art

Doing faults
and not correcting.
We name this...

nomorwords

doing github

portablepro
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Sorry, I am going on and on again.

This is still a major Bug. And if you don't fix it, it will somehow fight back.
It has always done.
Greetings

portablepro
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It has just been fixed by Microsoft

Never Thought, but has become reality....

portablepro
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Do I have to research at what Version this happened?

Meaning the Platform version.
Once this was for example X:\PortableApps
but you changed it to X:\PortableApps\PortableApps
I assume it to the introduction of the Documents folder.
At this time you didn't change or update the "howto portable" and this leads to some errors.
It even leads to some security problems that you don't want to have.
Greetings

John T. Haller
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Never Changed

The PA.c Platform has always offered X:\ as one of the defaults which creates the PortableApps directory at X:\PortableApps. It has never offered X:\PortableApps\PortableApps as an option unless the user manually browses to it or enters it. One way this can happen is if the user had the platform/apps installed to X:\PortableApps and then ran the Platform installer and manually selected X:\PortableApps instead of X:\ as the install location.

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portablepro
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I get it, but I think you are wrong.

Do a clean install in a VM
Of corse you changed the paths...
Blaming me to be a complete idiot, this doesn't work for me.
It goes for X:\PortableApps\PortableApps and leads to problems I told before?

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Worked As Expected, One Exception

In a clean Windows 10 VM with a flash drive plugged in, I ran the installer. Selected Portable Install. One option was listed, my USB drive as E:\. I selected that. The platform was correctly installed to E:\ with Start.exe, Documents, and PortableApps directories within.

I then downgraded and let the platform update itself using the built in updater. It worked as expected installing to E:\.

I then closed the platform and ran the platform installer again. It correctly defaulted to Upgrade Existing Install and then E:\ on the next page. It worked as expected installing to E:\.

Please note that there is one exception. If you already have a platform installed at X:\PortableApps\PortableApps\PortableApps.com and you select to upgrade X:\, it will select the deeper platform. To remedy this situation, remove the deeper platform.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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might be we found the problem...

Please note that there is one exception. If you already have a platform installed at X:\PortableApps\PortableApps\PortableApps.com and you select to upgrade X:\, it will select the deeper platform. To remedy this situation, remove the deeper platform.

That is a classical recursion error and there are ways to avoid this behavior.
But that is not what I was talking about. It still seems to be a major bug.
Please keep in mind, that I really like your software, I am just trying to optimize it.
HTH and Greetings!

portablepro
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one exeption

Please note that I told to do a CLEAN installation which exhibits any further installations.
HTH

John T. Haller
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No Issues

As detailed above, there are no issues with a clean install. You have one platform installed within another. Please remove the deeper platform to use the main.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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This is what you think about, but is not real.

I am throughout familiar with your installer. I might even perfect it for you in some ways.
No, i did not install it within another installation, there's no recursive.
HTH

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clean install

I also can not find any wrong behavior
I did just clean install on a pc, not on a stick, I got offered number of options. Selected the for all on this computer.
This did an install on the root of the drive and all apps I installed later went into the PortableApps directory.
No cascading of portableapps directory.

Then I downloaded manually an app, from website, not via platform and run the installer. It did correctly fill in the correct place and the app landed in the portableapps directory as expected.

All works as it should.

Otto Sykora
Basel, Switzerland

portablepro
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This hammers me now to be a complete idiot.

Am I the only one, to install it in a clean system and getting it wrong?
I do deal with this bug since years.
There are three possibilibities:
1. He knows the bug, but doesn't care about, because everytihing works correclty.
2. He knows the bug, but is to lazy to rewrite all the programs by some (installing) lines. - This is the version I found for real.
3. He has a somehow different computer, he can't recompute this bug. And so so he won't fix it.
Hello!

John T. Haller
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Can't Reproduce

No one has been able to reproduce your bug on any system so far. And I've tried multiple systems both new and upgrades. So, either it's something very odd about your specific system or you haven't properly conveyed the steps to reproduce.

Please try again and post the exact steps to reproduce. EVERY SINGLE STEP. So, you'd say what every screen of the PA.c Platform installer is, what option you select, clicking next, etc.

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

portablepro
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okay, you are about to confuse me now.

I really have to double check this, but I doubt, you are wrong.
HTH

portablepro
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no error

Because no one has ever found an error doesn't seem to be free of errors.
I found some and only told you about the major one. (tried to)
Helpless here now.

portablepro
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I told in my first post

If you aren't within windows linking system, you are off.
POINT.

Tried hard, but leading to only misunderstation, this leaves me pointless...
HTH

Edit: spelling

portablepro
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Can't Reproduce

I might perhaps help you out in some way...
Do it in a virtual machine as told before or do it in a physical new clean machine.

please.

You got me?

Then download extra "not within" a portable App and figure out where it is going to be installed.

I am now a bit tired to tell you about a major bug.
As always - I was giving three months of time to correct. - you won't fix it.
You got such a big fortune, I won't harm you and your software.

Edit:
I won't harm the plattform just for example that you did something wrong, causing security issues.
The thing about doing wrong assoiciatons is to think, that doesn't care.
That is the most easy way to intrude a system.
This is recursive elevating system rights "in windows 10+" and that is exactly what you are doing by not correclty defining paths.
HTH

Greetings

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I did that (as many people

I did that (as many people many times before) and it just behaves as expected:
I download the PortableApps Platform installer (PortableApps.com_Platform_Setup_22.0.1.paf.exe) and launch it.
- Select language, license agreement...
- New installation
- Local all users, drive c:\ as preselected (or select folder and choose d:\ for secondary hd...)
- all folders and files go exactly where they should go - Documents folder, and PortableApps folder in C: root (or D: root when chosen manually)
I download any app from the PAc website and launch it => it suggests the right folder (C:\PortableApps\PicPickPortable in my example) and goes there. No double PortableApps folder as you described or anything unexpected.
I did this over a hundred times now in various occasions and different setups (pendrives, external hd/ssd, system root directory, secondary hd, subfolder and so on). I never experienced anything you name as major bug here. Keep in mind that the platform used to have a huge user base and many people would have reported that bug before (it is no special usecase to install the platform and apps separatly, many people do that).

So, if you want to find out, what is going wrong here, please start giving detailed information what you do (every single step as John asked for) and not the sparse summaries you provided until now... No one can help or nail a potential bug as long as your steps cannot be reproduced... This whole thread is a mashup of many different aspects but no single one is explained precisely enough to be reproduced. I even don't understand your exact problem here.

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tested again, all correct

I tested again:
new install of the platform, this time on drive d:
again, I was asked number of questions before the actual install started, but all landed in d:\PortableApps
Then installed some apps from the platform function.
They all landed under d:\Portableapps\xxx

Downloaded manually an app and run the installer. This also found the correct place to be installed immediately and the install path was already correctly written in the line before installation really started.

Again, no double portableapps directory

Then I deleted all those folders, meanning simply deleting the d:\PortableApps directory

I do not use the platform in general, I have simply a folder on my c:\APPS
This is where I keep my portable apps on computer. When I now want install an app there, the installer will not find a place where to put it as there is no portableapps directory any more and I have to enter the path manually (or search for it)

again exactly as expected

On my usb stick, no platform installed, I install apps also simply by pointing the installer to the stick, this is all.

Otto Sykora
Basel, Switzerland

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tested in VM

tested in VM now
also here, I installed the platform on the c: , this happens automatically when selecting 'for all' when asked by the installer

Then any installation of apps, either by the platform or manually by download and running the exe will create the appropriate folder within the c:\portableapps and copy the files into it.
No double folders here too

I downloaded manually the Akelpad and run the installer. This automatically found out the c:\portableapps directory and created a folder for C:\PortableApps\AkelPadPortable and copied the files into it. This path was shown in the installer just bofore the installation started and did not select anything manually and did not search for the path or similar.
The akelpad can be now started manually or via the platform

so also on VM, no described bug detected

Otto Sykora
Basel, Switzerland

portablepro
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I am sorry

Due to my not native english speaking issues I might not have been calling this thread a "major issue" though i posted it with a questionmark.
I should have called this a "minor issue" or a "perhaps issue".
I apologize for that. Please forgive me.
I think this forum is made for reporting problems, bugs etc. and talking about general things about how to make software portable within windows.

Just wanting to tell you how I was working:
On a new system I go for installing Windows on the system drive which I rename to C:sys.
Then I partition the drive into three partions named D:prog and E:data
This is a comfortable way to update your system by example from windows 7 to windows 10 or 11. - I have done this many times and it was comfortable and easy - that is the fortune of "portable software" not to care about registry entrys.

So normally I just compress my folder D:PortableApps via 7Zip and just copy it to another PC, unpack it and everything is okay and up to date, even if this computer doesn't has an internet connection and is offline. Due to technical effects or just by security/privacy.

The standard structure of PortableApps to beeing installed to drive D: is like this:
And no, this is meant to be installed like this as of for example the Desktop.ini file states the correct icon for this file/folder.
So the portable programms are meant to be installed to D:\PortableApps\PortableApps, it is meant to be installed to
So you keep the structure clean and lean and you have a different documents folder which has an also different Desktop.ini file which leads to
IconFile=..\PortableApps\PortableApps.com\App\Graphics\WindowsFolderIcons\documents.ico

So this is meant to be as it is and this is logically correct and fine. THX

thx, have to afk

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Hello portablepro,

Hello portablepro,
thanks for your answer. That helps to sort the different feedback you provided. I understand that some facets get lost in transation, no big deal, I am no native speaker, too. Please understand the demand to specify your approach more accurate as our interest to deal with your problem, if possible.

So, as I see it, the whole issue is resolved for now. There is no real bug during the installation process at first (some of your posts implied a weird folder stucture, that no one could reproduce, but that seemd to be a missunderstanding).

The only issue left is, that the PAc-installer picks up your specific folder structure and misinterprets it, because it stops after finding the first "PortableApps" folder. If I understand you correctly, you wish the installer to do it right, which would possible result in a somewhat sizeable adjustment or rewrite of parts of the code. I don't know, if it is even possible with the current language (it is written in NSIS, originally a scripting language for installers, as you might know).

Apart from that, it would be a fix for a very specific problem, while there is an easy fix on your side: Just don't give your top level folder for portable apps in general the name "PortableApps", as that is reserved as top level folder for the platform itself.
You can compare it to reserved folder names in many OS. Try messing with the folders WINDOWS, SYSTEM, USERS in your common windows setup. Mostly it is no big deal, but some things can really break stuff there, so you better not try.
So, to make a long story short: Try renaming your top level folder to something like "Portable" or "PApps" or "MyPortableApps", that sould fix the problem for you. The issue itself is mostly academic. In real life it only occurs with a very special setup, yours in this case. Wink

If I misunderstood you, feel free to correct me.

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very thanks to this post.

I really do appreciate to this post.
Thank you!

portablepro
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Edit:

The only issue left is, that the PAc-installer picks up your specific folder structure and misinterprets it, because it stops after finding the first "PortableApps" folder.
There is no problem about finding paths, as I told before, I have been doing this on a clean install where never ever has been installed any ".paf.exe"
HTH

portablepro
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please try it out for yourself in an clean install.

Do it just one time.
You will get the directory structure intented to be.
Nore to be calling me an idiot...
Might be that I am fault, but trying to hesitate

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When noone can reproduce your

When noone can reproduce your bug with your descriptions, you have three options:

  • Your descriptions need to be more specific or detailled, or
  • The bug is triggered by something in your setup, or
  • The bug is suppressed by something in my/our setup

All three cases can only be analyzed if you give more information. Until now, you did not list every step or action you take in a replicable way so at least I have no means to understand, where you see a bug here.
I did this more then once again in the last week on different computers and drives (I do this quite often, but have my routine that may vary from yours) and did not encounter anything like that. I won't get the double nested folders you described before, no matter what I do. But maybe I missed something you did not tell here.

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okay

You win.
I got nothing more to say.

John T. Haller
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Closed, Conclusions

As this thread seems unproductive and the original poster has not replied with a set of instructions to reproduce the error, I'm closing this issue. As a reminder, the default location for installing the PA.c Platform is the root of a portable drive. You can manually install it to D:\PortableApps if you wish. This will create Start.exe, PortableApps, and Documents within the D:\PortableApps directory, so your apps for the platform will be within D:\PortableApps\PortableApps.

When you run a standalone PA.c Installer for an app, it will not recognize your PA.c Platform location if it is custom. It will only do a simple search of all available drives for X:\PortableApps and offer to install to the last of those drives. It doesn't search deeper. If you have a custom location for the PA.c Platform, you'll need to manually select where it is. Or, better option, use the PA.c Platform's install function under Apps - Install a New App (.paf.exe).

Sometimes, the impossible can become possible, if you're awesome!

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