File Associations in the PortableApps.com Platform, How Windows 8 & 10 Break Things, What Do You Think?

Aside: I tend to right click and associate rather than double click and *expect* an association. Which method do most other PA folks use?

The significance is that I don't expect a file association to work unless I've done the exercise but other people might regardless of whether they've just plugged into a "new to them" system ... which seems rather odd to me. I'm the guest after all!

I'd be happy if I could right click and use Send To.

I would vote for adding the functionality as-is, but leaving it off by default. If I understand correctly, the problem with the new system in Windows 8+ makes this functionality unusable for the "I use PA because I take my USB-stick on the road" crowd, but still perfectly usable for the "I use PA because I prefer it over installed software on my PC" crowd. The latter is a big part of your audience (possibly the majority), and many of us really would like to set file associations controlled by the PA platform. So I would opt to give us this option, add a warning to it, and then let us use it at our own discretion. Users who really want file associations, will also understand the technical limitations (and our responsibility for not messing up other people's PC's). Users who are not interested (or don't care) will never be confronted with this, as we'd explicitly have to opt in to be able to use this.

In addition, I wonder whether there still might be a possibility to implement a technical solution that could prevent a PA user messing up someone else's system. As outlined above, within the current framework file associations are only going to be practical on user's own systems. So why not implement a kind of "system check": use/calculate a unique ID for your computer hardware, and limit the file associations to that particular system. I.e. if you're working on your own PC, you use the file associations defined within the PA platform - but if you use the platform on a different PC, the check fails and Windows' default file associations are used. This would mean that if you copy the platform to a new PC, you'd have to re-define the associations again (once per file type) but I would still find that quite acceptable. I see two potential stumbling blocks with my own suggestion:
1. it might be difficult to implement technically - I simply have no idea how easy/difficult this would be ...
2. you might not like the suggested idea of a per-system ID as it goes somewhat against the idea of "full portability". But I would argue that with file associations, we are by their very definition on the boundary between the (local) operating system and the (possibly portable) software application, and then would vastly prefer a practical solution that would help many users, even if it is not 100% "ideologically pure".

On a final note: whichever way this ends up going, I really appreciate the fact that you have not given up on the idea of setting file associations, and are still considering possible solutions despite the extra hurdles created by Microsoft.

I am against any kind of associations. I use portable apps only very seldom and in special cases from lokal drive and this only temporarry. If I want use a program from lokal drive and have all the features windows will provide for it, I install it properly.
For portable use, any file association is not needed, still can not understand why this might be an issue at all.

if someone is using portable apps just because be too lazy to set up his computer properly, well then he can not expect all to work the same way as when all is set up properly.

Portable apps need to be most useful for portable use and this is the first sens of having portable apps at all. To have any file association in a portable app is rather useless, unless for those few people who still believe the PC will run slowly when the install programs the way it is designed.

And when I use portable app, let say libre office, and I need to open a file with it, all I need is to oen the office and navigate to the file. No need to do it the other way around and hope break the operating system just because I want have it the upside down way.

Why not use a portable file manager that supports its own file type associations?

I use Windows 10 and I don't know how to make all the file associations, permanently (I use the suite only with my own laptop only). Did you solve the problem?

I just created account to back up this idea. Some programs have built-in options to create file associations but some of them (e.g. LibreOffice) doesn't. It would be great to have some ways of doing it in more automatic, platform-level way.
For me the most useful option is locally creating permanent associations as I use platform to speed up updates etc. But if you could implement something like eXpresso for truly portable users - that would be great. Maybe make both of these options as a kind of plugins for platform? That way only people interested in them would install them, knowing consequences and limitations.

One more thing - as you control which programs are on the platform, would it be possible to create some kind of predefined templates of associations? For example Foxit Reader would have only one template (with .pdf etc.) but VLC Player could have different ones for music and video. After adding such template to user's configuration fine tuning it for user's needs would be much easier than manually creating all these associations.

Thanks to the flexibility of PA's, I use them from USB's and syncing them through the cloud. Which means I have PA's on my main computer that are always there now - and prefer them that way for many of the reasons people have mentioned.

I wouldn't mind an administrative way to change the file association - or at least a way to add the correct registry entries needed so I can go into the Control Panel and change the file associations for the default programs myself. It would take some effort on my (the user's) part but I think, with a clear explanation on what needs to be done and why it might not work if you do not have administrative option, it could work for both camps - those on the go and those that never go.

Just a think. I am not an expert in informatics.

Any news about file association?

Have you considered using a Portable file browser that has its own file associations and leave the OS's associations unaffected? Not the best solution, but I could live with it. Better yet, all (or any) portable file browsers could be made to first check for a portable association and, if none exists, then use the OS's association.

(When I posted this, I did not notice that this has already been suggested.)

there are 2 portable solutions that dont use the registry. of course that excludes url links inside applications.

1. Portable explorers like:
XenonPortable this one is slow, much slower then the one i made, and also ugly, even uglieer than mine
XYPlorer wich is good but using rightclickmenu for associations only works in PRO version, but doubleclick runs your apps

2. Catching clicks in explorer.
Café (alias expresso) is one. but no menu, only doubleclick, so again made my own with menu

my explorer: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1649772/explorer.png
my menu: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1649772/menu.png
i don't use the launcher anymore my explorer handles it all, even recent files

are these not better than messing with the registry?

A other option is jauntePE, it can intercept everything.
It could be set up to only catch the part in the registry where the fileassociations are storred. It can intercept anny childprocess of portableapps.

However it's in alfa stage and no longer devellopped. I think

I think catching the clicks from explorer is the most portable way.

1- we dont touch registry.

2- we can revert all settings back with one click (this action is possible with portabellapps-file-associator. but it is not %100 secure, if you change or delete the /data folder of portabellapps-file-associator.)

expresso-type app is better. + it shoudl always have a "send to" options for apps like vlc, notepad++...

@John T. Haller what is the latest news about association..

The problem is that it can not be reliably implemented.
MPC-HC for instance has no fileassociations. As do many others.
And firefox has manny, but url is missing, wich is important.
Also there is no general rule where to store the users prefrence on doubleclick or enter. where do i store that info, or am i free todo whatever? There need to be a common place where i can look for it, so that my app would use the same setings as expresso or any other portable explorer.

See the problem?

I dont use the registry, but on that matter, what does the users choice matter if the user says to use portable associations, especialy if its on a fixed drive.
And if not, you could backup the userschoice an restore it when done, or am i wrong here?

I used to be a expert for fileassociotions, but got tired of it, and made my own explorer. Much better now.

also i found this in firefox app info:
[Associations]
FileTypeCommandLine=-requestPending -osint -url "%1"
i sincerely hope that is for the launcher FirefoxPortable.exe to handle?
it is not productive to let 3th party app handle this?

also there is no reliable info in the appInfo.ini file that says this is a "web Browser"
for opera: Description=Web browser, email and torrent client
that is just a sentence.

Please John create some rules.

Also for filetypes i would like to see added "\" as to indicate a folder
Aimp for instance would happily play a folder
FileTypes=\,aac,ac3,acs2,acs3,aimppl,......

And maybe * might be used for all filetypes

And John, Thx for the effort for doing all these apps, and keeping up with us whiners.

I have two suggestions which may be the best method to implement this feature given the current OS restrictions.

First I would take an approach similar to your autorun portableapps on drive insertion. I would make an option in the GUI to install a local program that handles the file associations and passes them on to a portableapps platform of our choosing or whichever one is running (I tend to run more then one so both options would be great). If none are running pass it onto a system default, if there are some running pass it on to the platform. Then in any windows version you could set it to always send to portableapps file association manager which would let us add/edit a default for when portableapps isn’t running. An even easier method would be to auto run whatever the default was set to before the manager took over it. Then you don’t have to have users manually configure everything and program it all in.

For example. If my browser default was set to Firefox and I installed the portableapps file association manager it would read the default before asking me to change the default to the manager. Then it can pass the command onto the platform if it has a portable Firefox installed, or let me choose which program it should run. When that isn’t available or it times out then simply run the system default.

This method obviously isn’t purely portable but from what I see its the best compromise between the options. Then only users who want it would install it and set it to default and those who don’t would just ignore the option. It would definitely leave behind a program and settings but most users wouldn’t care or even notice so long as it auto runs the system default when the platform is not running. That way I could also choose to install it on my grandparents machines so when I am working on them it runs on my portable apps but as soon as I eject the flash drive it goes back to their defaults. They would never realize it isn’t the default from a technical standpoint. I would also be using it on my own computer for many of the same reasons the other users said they use it on their local machines.

Second there is another method which may or may not be closer to true portable but a huge pain to implement and riddled with peril. Taking a page from the methods used by anti-virus programs. That is setup the portableapps file association manager to use an approach similar to On-Access Scanning and if the platform is running stop the execution and pass it onto portableapps. Otherwise allow it to run as normal. This would likely require some sort of custom driver to intercept hard drive events such as anti-virus software use. It seems they can be installed and ran without a restart such as the newest versions of Avast running on Windows 10. It is able to install the full anti-virus and do scans without me having to restart. I could see this method causing tons of problems especially with anti-virus programs that also are doing that themselves and taking many hours to implement and debug. Its the only way I can see being able to make it closer to truly portable assuming windows not only lets you install this driver but uninstall it without restarting. I haven’t really checked the new win32 api events added with windows 10 so for all I know it no longer takes custom drivers but rather an event interceptor. Just a thought, not sure it would be worth the time to try and implement it. Especially if it were to require a windows signature as an anti-virus security company to allow access to these low level options. Since it seems to know what anti-viruses are installed and only accepts one on their list to auto disable windows defender I assume it requires an agreement.

Personally if I were writing the program for this feature I would make an option based on my first suggestion since its both optional to the end user and would not hinder the system with tons of broken file defaults every time I remove my drive with the portable apps platform on it. Hope this suggestion helps and keep up the great work!